The Heralding of History (Again) Part 2: Paul Wolter

Show Transcript

Announcer: 0:04

Welcome to frame of reference informed intelligent conversations about the issues and challenges facing everyone in today's world, in depth interviews with salt counties, leaders and professionals to help you expand in and form your frame of reference, brought to you by the max FM digital network. Now, here's your host Rauel LaBreche.

Rauel LaBreche:

 0:26

Well, welcome to another edition of frame of reference your 907 Max FM's digital network. I, you know, I enjoy it when I have an opportunity to interview someone that's been on the show before and who I've actually gotten kind of to know through our radio endeavors over time. But my guest today, Paul Volter, who is the Executive Director of the sock County Historical Center, is society. Sorry, it's a society

Paul Volter:

 0:52

we have both Yes. The center at the society. So

Rauel LaBreche:

 0:57

Paul has been on this show yet. He was on Morning sipping Firelands a number of times. And that's kind of where we found that we had some common bond stew in our history, which was, was fun. But thanks, Paul, for joining me again, always a pleasure roll as we get into the Christmas season. I always think of you because that was our first endeavors together where it's you would come and talk about the Christmas house things going on right at the Vander van orden van orden I always want to see Vanderbilt.

Paul Volter:

 1:25

Well, not quite to that scale. But yeah,

Rauel LaBreche:

 1:29

I just it's in my brain. I got the vendor bill. So Reedsburg Baraboo. Yeah, no van orden. So which is what we can talk about that a little bit too, but I'm imagining things are starting to pick up a little differently with COVID hopefully is going to settle down and stay settled down. Anyways, but welcome again and I'm gonna just get right to it. We want to do our favorite things and and get people to understand more about who is polled. Who's the real vaulter. Right. So let's start with something really tough. Okay, what's your favorite bug?

Paul Volter:

 2:07

Oh, bug. Well, I would have to say dragonfly, I just think they're beautiful. And, you know, there's certain bugs that just have a bad rap there. You know, sort of people love spiders, somebody loves spiders, but I don't dragon flies, just, you know, they're in you know, even somewhat ancient, you know, you'll go to France and the, you know, symbol of some fiefdom or Chateau is a dragon fly. It's never gonna be the spider. So yeah, I think they're kind of a neat.

Rauel LaBreche:

 2:36

There's a my wife and daughter have a big thing about dragonflies. And oftentimes my daughter will like gift my wife something that's got a dragon play on it. And that all goes back to I don't know if you remember the show Gilmore Girls heard and there was the in that Lorelei opens up is the dragon fly and it becomes, you know, kind of an ongoing thing with them too. But weren't they? Are they the ones that were called stitcher bugs or something like that, too? I know. I remember there being something about at least it was an insect that looked like the dragonfly and my mom or somebody told me that there stitcher bugs and if they get too close here, they'll stitch up your skin and I'm like, Wow, I'm sorry. Like terrified. Like I don't want anything stitching up my skin. Yeah, so might have been one of those old wives tale

Paul Volter:

 3:22

you know it's funny because flies who wants to fly but then at Dragon Dragon Fly cool that they're making roaches and art?

Rauel LaBreche:

 3:31

Yeah, much bigger than a regular fly. I'm a dragon fly. Yeah, so yeah, that was another thing flies we're like get the house fly. It's otter door the flies will get in. Right? We have a lot of phobias from my childhood. So But how about do you have a favorite quote? Boy boy something that you go to or think of fairly regularly that is inspiring or kind of helps I have things in my life that I think of that help keep me on track. And you know,

Paul Volter:

 4:10

it's funny, I don't want nothing on the top of my head. Okay, I suppose from reading so much historical stuff, you get a lot stored in there.

Rauel LaBreche:

 4:19

Well, let's take that maybe I'll think of something as a question. Do you have a favorite, a favorite historical personality?

Paul Volter:

 4:28

Well, when I was younger, Thomas Jefferson was intriguing. I think for his love of architecture and, and stuff like that. Of course, the older you get, you know, you you realize his foibles and stuff and Sure, sure, the slavery and things like that, but but still a remarkable person but locally, you know, I people kid me on Mona Larson's always accused me of making up holidays, which I do, I start, and there's always some Centennial next year, there's always a centennial around the corner for something so But I started William Canfield Dave started 20 years ago to honor our you know, local Astoria first first local historian here in Salt County. Okay. So he's he's, you know, lived to be in his 90s and was just endlessly interested when he was in his 80s he started cultivating silkworms. He thought we should all be growing silkworms to make silk and sugars even mulberry trees in in bearable that are still left from his endeavors to when he was defeated them. Yes. So

Rauel LaBreche:

 5:34

interesting. So I can feel that's a is there like a beverage or a beer or something that's Canfield? Is that a fairly popular or

Paul Volter:

 5:43

could be? Not a totally, you know, uncommon name, but yeah, but make sure I'm sure that's that's the only one I know.

Rauel LaBreche:

 5:52

That makes me think of the Hatfields Yeah. Yeah, so how much do you have a favorite movie?

Paul Volter:

 6:00

I love I love A Christmas Story. Okay, the whole like, I have the full size leg lamp. Okay. Which is coming out? A little boy that yes, the red flyer red Ryder BB gun. Yeah. It was kind of like a lot of the stories my dad told kind of growing up, roughly in that era. I kind of just just see as from that movie. Love Princess Bride. By the way I'm walking Symphony Orchestra is going to be playing it playing the soundtrack live to Princess Bride on January 1. And second, really. So they're showing the movie and showing the movie while they play the soundtrack live so it might be fun to go. So yeah,

Rauel LaBreche:

 6:41

that sounds like that's been one of the favorite movies in my family too. And we quote line this time.

Paul Volter:

 6:48

I mean, there's not one. There's dozens of lines from it.

Rauel LaBreche:

 6:52

Yeah, we have. We have a refrigerator magnet with cash. Why can Indigo? Yeah, I'm the frigerator says I don't think that word means what do you think it means? Which is if anyone's out there listening that hasn't watched a Princess Bride. It is just a fantastically funny movie. It's I forget Chris, who's the one guy that was in multiple movies like spinal tap and This Is Spinal Tap in there. Forget that actors named Chris Grissom are. Oh, goodness. Anyways, he he plays. He plays the night that's going out to see him. He's got the sixth finger or whatever it is. Right. So very, very odd. Isn't that like Rob?

Paul Volter:

 7:41

Rob Reiner? Yeah, right.

Rauel LaBreche:

 7:43

What's his first movie or his first? Yeah, so there's so

Paul Volter:

 7:47

many. And there's so many, you know, known people in it? Sure. You know, sure. Under the giant, of course, known people and I can't think of their names. But

Rauel LaBreche:

 7:57

yeah, there's well Mandy Patinkin who didn't go right. And I didn't realize but about that same time is when he was on Broadway. Yeah. Doing Sunday in the Park with George. So and you know, so you don't get to hear it. And that, but he had to mute beautiful voice to

Paul Volter:

 8:16

from the hospital show. Oh, wait, that's that guy.

Rauel LaBreche:

 8:20

Isn't that weird to how you go back and see things is like, Oh, wow, I never realized he was there. You know, some of the big stars to have these like little bit roles and movies. You're like, Yeah, we had no idea. Right? So how about a favorite? I think I asked you this the first time, but do you have a favorite book?

Paul Volter:

 8:38

Well, the Bible Bible. Beyond that, you know, unfortunately, I do not do a lot of just reading, you know, novels and things like that, I suppose, because I've read so much historical

Rauel LaBreche:

 8:52

documents. So is there a document that you've run across over time that really has stood out as a special document?

Paul Volter:

 9:00

Well, you know, every once in a while we'll come across you know, firsthand accounts. We we came across a typed manuscript of a Civil War soldiers diary, just recently tried to find it was a Saccone guy from the middle of summer in the middle of Castle prairie area, and, and was in the in the war for three or four years and faithfully kept a diary. So this turned out to be about 100 pages of typing, if you can imagine that single spaced typing. So unfortunately, we don't we seem to have gotten just this copy and this is sometime in the 1980s. So we don't know where the original journal is, or ended up or journals, quite frankly. But yeah, just to have the type version is amazing. So to hear, you know, it's one thing to study history, but then to read these firsthand accounts, sure, you know, makes it much more relatable. personal one? Sure. Yeah.

Rauel LaBreche:

 10:02

So let's moving along the topic of history, this might be an impossible one for you to answer. Right up, there were quote, so just think of a quote, you know, some FDR quote anything. Right, right. So anything will fall away. But how about a? Is there a is historical? I don't want to say event again, because that's not exactly what I'm thinking of. But is, I guess, is there a historical, something that happened in history that you became aware of, in your studies, and through your association with history? That was much more important than you realized? It was? You know, because it seems to me that there are these events that we don't recognize at the time they happen, how forming they are, how, you know, indicative they are of all kinds of things just going to happen afterwards, right? Is there something like that, that you've seen?

Paul Volter:

 10:58

Well, and I always, I love local history, because it's local, you know, you can go to the spot, you live in the house, you, you know, the people, you're, you're studying or researching new the same place as we do now be it they looked a lot different, you know, so in that vein, you know, I like putting, you know, looking at local history, and its context to, you know, national and international history. So the Badger plant, you know, you grew up coming over that bluff, seen that vast city, especially at night, all the lights on, you're like, what's that? And then you were told it was the powder plant, you know, and then you and you get a little more knowledge. So it was World War Two, it started blah, blah, blah, but then to realize what an enormous part it played in national and of course, international affairs. Sure is, and then you grew up, and then I learned three of my four grandparents worked there. My dad worked there at various times. So you know, then you have this connection? Sure. Sure. Yeah. And similarly, like, we'll talk about the depot, but the railroad coming through the heart of sock County just just changed everything.

Rauel LaBreche:

 12:06

Are there buildings that that we don't even recognize right now, let's say historical landmarks, because I know it takes quite a bit, you've gone through that process of having something become a historical landmark significant place, or their age, do you think I mean, is that more often than not, not done for places that should be considered significant? And yeah,

Paul Volter:

 12:26

I mean, you know, the National Register of Historic Places is, it's, it's rare that something gets sought out. I mean, it's all kind of, like, I'd love to have my house on or my building on, sometimes districts will get formed. But yes, there's, there's way more that could and, or should be on, then is on, you know, so I can't think of anything right off the top of my head. But, but yeah, there's plenty of that would, would be eligible.

Rauel LaBreche:

 12:54

It seems I just, I guess, as I'm getting older, you know, in my 60s now, and I always, not always, fairly regularly have the thought as I'm walking by a place or a house or one time thing. I wonder what the stories of that yes are wonder what that you know, what were the people like that lived there? What were the jobs like, you know,

Paul Volter:

 13:11

people that, you know, have an older home or something a little what, what makes an historic home? And I always say, Well, every house has a history. Right? You know, they're all historic homes. I mean, it could be as ugly as box. And, you

Rauel LaBreche:

 13:24

know, August your lips was a building in town here that they had to tear down to build the, the Walgreens. And yeah, there were people that tried to last minute kind of save it and weren't successful. Yeah.

Paul Volter:

 13:35

But at the same time, that everything that is old, should be saved. But we but once it's gone, it's gone. And you asked about a building that's maybe unrecognized and you know, brings me back to the barebow depot. You know, when I when I people here that we've we've taken on the depot, they're like, What depot are you talking about? And part of it is it's so large it doesn't read like the typical one story cute little town depot, you know, but but an enormously important building for that just bear with it. But sock County, sure. And really, really the state there's only it's being listed on the National and State registers soon, and there's only like four of these depot slash Division Headquarters buildings left in the state. Wow. And there was only you know, a number of them to begin with, because there was only so many divisions or any any railroad. Sure. So,

Rauel LaBreche:

 14:31

so to have one in your area really is Yeah, yeah, we think of the total number of cities and whatnot

Paul Volter:

 14:36

is bigger than Madison's Yeah. You know, deep any of Madison's depots, just because

Rauel LaBreche:

 14:41

it was, was there a railroad house to like one of those

Paul Volter:

 14:44

28 stalls, started out as eight and then grew to 28 stalls. So practically, fully 360 was at least three quarters of a circle, you know, so Yeah, another reason that the depot is so important, it's really the last remaining Building related to the Chicago Northwestern operation unbearable and really one of the few, the Reedsburg depot is still there, but not too many other buildings related to the railroad. Okay.

Rauel LaBreche:

 15:12

Do you have a favorite museum?

Paul Volter:

 15:16

Well, I got to the met a few years ago in New York, and of course, you know, only a few hours. So that's, that's an amazing place to get back to local more locally, the pain in the pain Art Museum in Oshkosh is wonderful. Of course, I'd love any of them that are in an historic house or mansion, you know, versus just a museum. Sure, but the pain always has wonderful programming. And

Rauel LaBreche:

 15:46

so both of those are art museums. Right? Well,

Paul Volter:

 15:49

yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. I mean, the map, you know, you can go see 5000 year old Egyptian artifacts and things as well. But you know, the decorative arts, and I have an art degree. So I suppose you have some background in architecture, too, don't you? Well, just in getting my art degree, it took as much art architectural history as I could. And then of course, I was a contractor and doing a lot of historic preservation work for 20 years, which

Rauel LaBreche:

 16:14

is was kind of the circuitous route, or the meandering route you took to your current job, right?

Paul Volter:

 16:19

Yeah, they were, I mean, I started volunteering at the Historical Society and doing that, but of course, I fell in love with the Sauk County Historical Society at first because of our our built the Vanguard mansion, beautifully preserved 1904 building, so Okay, yeah.

Rauel LaBreche:

 16:37

Okay, last question. And then we'll break it. So I've asked you this question before, but I'm hoping maybe you'll have another story, but you have a favorite memory of favorite historical event in your life, or you know, favorite just something that happens that when it happens today, or when you think of it today just takes you back to a you know, a time that you I don't know that we necessarily get sad about it, but just like why? Yeah, that's, that was an important thing.

Paul Volter:

 17:04

Yeah. Oh, boy, there's probably a lot but I love Christmas time. You know, just happy memories around that. I remember being like, probably four and begging my mother to drive into Lake Delton. So I could see the garland over the one intersection that then exit the one stoplight that then existed in Lake Delton. If you can wrap your head around that, you know, just to process the garlands and some orange balls, you know, and a bell in the middle, maybe. You know, yeah. So. So that's that those

Rauel LaBreche:

 17:36

little wonderful things that you know, when we get older, it's like I was nothing but when we're kids, it just seems like you know, magic. Yeah. Yeah. The Tinsley lights and all that jazz.

Paul Volter:

 17:46

That's fun to create the be involved in creating that kind of stuff. For sure. You know, kids today. Sure. 21st Christmas of the van orden mansion.

Rauel LaBreche:

 17:57

Okay. Folks, my guest today is Paul Volter, the executive director of the Suffolk County Historical Society. We're gonna take a quick break to hear a word from our sponsors. And we come back here we'll get into the meat of things here on history. So don't go anywhere. We'll be right back on frame of reference.

Commercial:

 18:19

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Rauel LaBreche:

 18:52

and we're back here at frame of reference. So WR PQ 99.7 Max FM's digital network. They almost said morning set Macfarlanes I think being with a guest that was on that show with me. I haven't done that for months and months and all of a sudden I want to do that old show to trigger a trigger. Yeah, something like that. So you can't say trigger anymore because there's too much gun violence. To say you're an impetus there's an influence I did something anywho i My guest today is Paul Volter the executive director of the Sauk County Historical Society and center I've found that whether it's actually can say both things and it's yeah,

Paul Volter:

 19:32

we run the County History Center at the County Historical Society. Okay.

Rauel LaBreche:

 19:36

And that History Center is actually in bear boo as well. Just a different building.

Paul Volter:

 19:41

Yeah, another historic building, the old Island woollen mill office building. So another another important kind of forgotten piece of Saccone history both the woollen mill in Baraboo and the one in Reedsburg produced probably millions of yards of wool fabrics from 18 Six Three to Well, the one reads were granted till the 1960s. So nearly 100 years worth of wool fabric production in sock County. And Aren't there a

Rauel LaBreche:

 20:09

whole bunch of wool blankets for like World War One,

Paul Volter:

 20:12

they mean yeah, 10s 10s of 1000s of wool, Army blankets, they didn't make a lot of finished goods, you know, they mostly made fabrics for later on for even Ford Packard and Studebaker cars and wool fabrics from bearable, but the army blankets you whack off a Hunka fabric. There you go. So amazingly, we have one at the at the History Center, the old office building, in a case was tattered, looks like it went to the Spanish American War and came back. So pretty amazing. Wow.

Rauel LaBreche:

 20:43

So history, you're an expert in history. And we're gonna say that whether or not they're bigger experts or whatnot, there's always somebody that knows more than we do. Right? Exactly. So, but it's being someone's been surrounded with history as intimately and intensely as you have. Is there something about history that you think most people miss? Because I hear people, especially the kids will talk about a history class, oh, my God, oh, boy, why do I care about these dates? And even older people that just don't seem to appreciate the importance of being aware of what happened before? Yeah. What What's your take on that? How do you try to bring somebody into the fold? If

Paul Volter:

 21:30

you Yeah, well, you know, there will always be levels of interest, you know, you may be into airplanes, I could, you know, I like to fly in airplanes, but I don't care how it works, or that, you know, this or that. So, there is that, but, you know, there's always the cliches of, you know, if we don't remember, history will be doomed to repeat it, which is, which has some truth to that, you know, in certain situations, but but it really, you know, and one of our tag lines, it's on our every newsletter is let the past enrich your present, you know, we just talked about memories, you know, which, which is history, it's your personal history of what you experienced, and what made you happy or sad, and that can just, just, you know, a certain smell or food or whatever, can bring back those emotions. So, sure, I think, you know, and when people start to, you know, disdain, history, it's that old, why do I have to memorize all these dates and, and these names and stuff? And, you know, it's kind of the same in other other subjects, too. Why did I learn why did I learn calculus? I have no idea, you know, brain exercise, I guess. But, but I think history can really well, whether it's as mundane as, you know, when the state puts a road in. And we always get notices of improvements that do we know of any, you know, historical things along this route, Indian mounds or historic buildings that might be impacted? You know, we have to speak up. I think I think history in some levels is just so important, especially local history for what makes an area unique, you know, we're learning that people can, more and more work just about anywhere, you know, they can be in any state any cities. So what you know, what makes a place unique is not the big box. It's places like Macfarlanes, that have a store like this, and you know, the certain I can go to different different cities in, in Sauk County and tell there was a builder that liked to build that kind of house because it's all over this town, right downtown Sauk city here as these kind of unique commercial buildings are two storey and yet there's this third kind of story window. It's like, it's not really clear story window, but it's like, what is that? Is that an attic? window or whatever, you know, and they don't find them anywhere else. So I think local history can, you know, be it's part of that placemaking that everybody's, you know, seeking talking about. And so other things too, like having a great sock trail and, you know, great, great events and things like that, but they're often historically related. You go on the great sock trail, and there's 666 or more signs talking about the bridge that was here or the three thinkers hall or the indigenous people in architects

Rauel LaBreche:

 24:30

Yeah, certain kinds of block. Building and

Paul Volter:

 24:34

again, you're gonna have some people that never will never will never care. Right, you know, but there's plenty of people that do as long as it's, you know, interesting and relatable. I just happen to come from a great storytelling dad, who always was telling stories about growing up. And a mom that just loved detail facts, you know, put those together and I have to know the truth. I have a good story about local history. And that's I do love to tell a true story. You know, I kind of tend to shy away from legend and lore, because they're just that. Sure.

Rauel LaBreche:

 25:10

Sure. Does it seem, is there an inter lapping place? I mean, it strikes me that legend and lore are important. I always wonder what's the original story?

Paul Volter:

 25:20

Exactly what happened. At some point, there's this apocryphal story, you know, the the Bank of Baraboo, which was now what's now bear with state bank, you know, was instrumental in helping the Ringling Brothers Circus get started. And, you know, given loaning them money when they were stuck in the mud in the late 1880s. And really, you know, kind of going out on a limb a little bit on this, this, this enterprise, and it really, definitely helped helps the circus survive and then grow. So vice versa, there's a legend that the bank was was facing a panic or a run at some point. And the Ringling Brothers heard about it. And one of the Ringling Brothers or several mentioned wrote up on a horse on Monday morning, as people were standing in line waiting for the bank to open to pull out all their savings. And he quelled that, you know, that run and the bank was saved, you know, so So I've, you know, I've heard that story for years. And it was down in Florida once at Charles wranglings daughter's place down there and then doing some research down there and came across Charles railings granddaughters account of that story. And I thought, you know, I'm gonna investigate this one. Here's, here's a family member talking about it, it's a lot closer than some somebody else. So you know, so when you start looking at what, what, what panics were there around this time period, and then you find out there were some panics. And unfortunately, for us, barebow had three newspapers at the time, so don't quote me, because I get a lot of dates in my head. Jerk, but I think it was the 8093 panic. And one of the banks and variable did close permanently. And there was, you know, it was attempts times, and the Bank of Baraboo, literally put out 10s of 1000s of dollars of currency and coin on their counters so that people could see, you know, we're okay, it's okay. And what they would also do at the time was, if you came in to take out your savings, they would give it to you in solid silver currency, which made it very heavy, so fine. And there was a story related in one of the papers of a farmer that came in and wanted his life savings pulled it out the 67 pounds of solid silver coin, and he took it around for a while and then thought the better of that and went to put it back in the bank. And they said, Oh, we've got all the silver we need. Thank you very much. So it made a little, you know, little object lesson out of him, you know, and but it wasn't finding you know, anything about the rings being involved. And of course, it was wasn't one of the Ringling Brothers riding on horseback in the middle of the night. You know, and but fortunately had three papers at the time and one of them, I think, I found the smoking gun, which was large sacks of silver continued to be received from Ringling Brothers Circus. So so I'm sure a call was made. Hey, guys, we need a little help. You know, if we get a run, we're going to start to spend seeing this in, in silver currency. Sure, for found out that Charles Ringling happened to be in town at the time, most likely for the birth of his daughter, which was imminent and happened a few days later. So I'm sure he was involved. And again, that story that I found in Florida was from his granddaughters roster, so. So that's what I like is, you know, my dad loved fishing. I like fishing at all my fishing is, you know, reading through old newspaper is trying to find that one nugget of truth. So that's, that's where I think that legend started. Sure. Yeah.

Rauel LaBreche:

 29:01

You know, it's interesting, too, because it makes me think of what's the saying to the, you know, to the victors go the spoils. But it's also that, that the victors in any war are the ones that write the history. Exactly. Yeah. And so, have you found examples of that, where, you know, the person that won the battle or whatever, had the most influence, they got to write things, the way things happened, but they really didn't happen quite that way.

Paul Volter:

 29:26

Right? Or, it's, there's more more to it than that. And, of course, we don't have like major, you know, conflicts here in in Sauk. County, but I will say that, you know, in the written history that indigenous peoples, you know, are not represented well, or Respectfully, oftentimes. So that's, that's been something we've been trying to remedy and, you know, tell a fuller picture. You know, there's unfortunate terms that are used, which obviously We don't you know, we don't use any more. In any rate, but but in general, you know, just telling more of that story. And sure, sure, we just had our third indigenous peoples day here in Sauk. County, in October. So that's been a great growing event. Actually, the next one will be here next October in Sauk. City. Okay, folks, the last three have focused on the whole chunk. And this one, of course, they will be there. But we will focus on the SOC tribe, and of course, the namesake of the county and the city. And so that'll be a great way to get that out as well.

Rauel LaBreche:

 30:39

Do you think that there's anything inherent in us as people that makes us want to rewrite history to fit our own motives agenda, whatever? Well, it seems like

Paul Volter:

 30:54

write or rewrite, or just write you know, because oftentimes, it's it's just, it's just us writing, you know, of course, we're familiar with our own story and our own culture and whatnot. So tha